[Raaze07]

What's the feeling for shooting Wolf ammo in our precious SIG's?

AMMOMAN.com currently has Wolf ammo

223 WOLF FMJ (full metal jacket) ON SALE - NEW ORDERS ONLY
55 OR 62 GRAIN YOUR CHOICE$269-1000 DELIVERED (that's the total price to your door)

What do you guys think? Hell of a price for plinking ammo, will it hurt the rifle?

 

[Longrifle]

Do a search on AR15.com and you'll find an endless number of threads about Wolf ammo both pro and con. I do know that because of the lacquer coating on some wolf loads it has a higher chance of getting stuck in the chamber where it heats up and accumulate. That can't be good for the ejector not to mention the hassle of removing said cartridge.

Empty cartridges get ejected forcefully against our 556's upper. It's bad enough with softer brass cases, so I'm not sure I would want Wolf steel casings doing that. I'm sure a number of people here would say they shoot it and everything's fine. Look at it this way, you wouldn't put cheap gas in a Ferrari would you? So, why take a chance with questionable ammo on a $2,000 rifle?

 

[abrams_34]

shot a few hundred rounds including 3 mags in rapid fire mode and not 1 problem i say buy it!!!

 

[racenet]

You load it, pull the trigger and it goes bang.

I've shot several thousands of rounds of Brown Bear (which is basically the same thing) without a single issue. No misfeeds, misfires or dud rounds, ever.

After several hundred rounds, just give your rifle a good cleaning and you are good to go.

 

[ullie]

What's the feeling for shooting Wolf ammo in our precious SIG's?

...good ammo + good mags =

...Wolf isn't good ammo...

...your gun...youir choice... :wink:

 

[ullie]

...steel versus brass cased ammo...

...steel cased ammo is almost always the "cheaper stuff"...and is hardly ever loaded to full power ammo pressure levels...likewise...steel isn't the "optimal" material for shell casings...it doesn't have the physical and mechanical properties of brass...you would be amazed by the number of things that occur when a shell is fired...related to the shell casing itself...that contribute to the reliable functioning of the firearm...

...brass is more lubrious than steel...which aids in the chambering of the round and the extraction of the shell casing...brass is more elastic than steel...so that the brass shells form a better gas seal against the chamber walls while the cartrage is firied...allowing less gas to escape...brass is more resilient than steel...so that it almost returns to it's origional shape while letting go of the chamber walls...brass cases relaxe and requires less force to extract...brass is also less brittle than steel...reducing the probability of permanant plastic deformation and cracking...brass has superior flow charastics...reducing the probability of rapture....brass has greater thermal conductivity...allowing the weapon to run cooler by absorbing more of the energy produced by the firing of the cartrage ...taking this energy with it when ejected...and brass is more corrosion resistant than steel...that is...brass won't rust...just to name a few...

 

[ullie]

...isn't "copy and paste" such a good thing...


...ya know...the 556 will eat "just about" anything you feed her...kinda like a garbage truck...however...i personally feel that with "any weapon" you should always use "good mags" and "good" ammo...that doesn't mean that the ammo needs to be expensive...

...the 556 will safely shoot any blend of SAAMI spec commercial 223 remington and also military spec 5.56 NATO ammunition safely...for plinking i would stay with the cheaper and more widely avaiable 55gr / 62 grain bullit weights...

...if you can find it Fed XM193 ( not the XM193 PD ) and winchenter Q3131 is great full power ammo...i would also recomend black hills, federal american eagal, any of the federal or winchester 223 ammo...PMC is also good as long as it was made in Korea...pass on the Mexican stuff...remington UMC is OK as is sellier and ballot...just a little underpowered IMO...just buy what's on sale...

...some of the ammunition i would avoid...wolf...silver bear...monarch...olympic...main cartrage company...ultramax...and any of the "foreign surplus" ammo that hits the market...

... ...a note about surplus ammo...countries do not "surplus" ammunition because they love to "give it away"...they surplus it because it is no longer considered acceptable..or was ever acceptable for military use...either it is "too old" or has "quality control issues"...some of which could be dangerous...and remember...most countries have their own specifications regarding "military" ammunition...you can never really be sure what you're getting...that's the short story...really...

 

[Raaze07]

Thanks Ullie - I appreciate the advice.

I'm going to pass on this ammo.

 

[siggy556cent]

...if you can find it Fed XM193 ( not the XM193 PD ) and winchenter Q3131 is great full power ammo...i would also recomend black hills, federal american eagal, any of the federal or winchester 223 ammo...PMC is also good as long as it was made in Korea...pass on the Mexican stuff...remington UMC is OK as is sellier and ballot...just a little underpowered IMO...just buy what's on sale...

hi ullie,

thanks for all the good info.

this is my first rifle where the ammo really makes a difference.. and i honestly don't really know all the ammo terminology yet.

so please bare with me.

what's the difference between Fed XM193 and Fed XM193 PD?

is there anything on ammo box labeling that would tell how much powder is in the round?

how can you tell if a given brand will be high-powered or under-powered?
or is that from your experience with shooting a variety of brands.

thanks for your help and patience.

 

[ullie]

what's the difference between Fed XM193 and Fed XM193 PD?

is there anything on ammo box labeling that would tell how much powder is in the round?

how can you tell if a given brand will be high-powered or under-powered?
or is that from your experience with shooting a variety of brands.

...Fed XM193 are lots of ammunition that were pulled as "seconds" due to minor quality control issues...such as a few shells found with improperly sealed primers that were found in a production run...XM193PD are culls...pulled from distribution due to greater quality control issues....XM193 is suitable for LEO/agency use...but not deemed acceptable for military distruibution...XM193PD is for training only...i would avoid it altogether...


...box is not marked with specific information on loading...

...5.56 NATO STANAG ammunition is loaded to greater presure levels than commercial SAMMI spec 223 Remington...they should be treated as two different cartrages...your 556 can fire either safely since it is chambered for 5.56 Nato ammo...

...use your search engine for more information...or read related posts in the ammunition section...

...here's a linky to get you started...the information is relatively accurate for your purposes...i suggest you download it and save for future refrence...since it seems to dissappear every so often...


... http://ammo.ar15.com/project/AmmoOracle_061808.pdf

 

[doming83]

I say if u like to shoot alot and dont want to pay alot wolf is your best bet.
The only problem i've had when shooting it is that some times it can be a bit under powered, and because it's loaded into steel casings your rifle gets really dirty. I have shot over a thousand rounds of wolf through my rifle. at a cost of $320 dollars. when all the other ammo i prefered was about $380 for 500 rounds. sure metal casings can ware your parts in the long run, but with all the money u save shooting it you can always buy a spare parts kit or any other parts that u need.

alot of people baby thier guns, i say u bought em for a purpose so shoot the hell out of em.

 

[Longrifle]

Like Ullie says, it's your gun. Shoot whatever ammo you're comfortable with. We wouldn't be having this Wolf discussion if ammo prices weren't so ridiculous. Just a few years ago M193 and Q3131 boxes of 20 can be had for as little as $4.

But then again a few years ago none of us had a 556! :lol:

 

[762nato]

I know a guy who deals in machine guns,and he said he has talked to several guys that have blown up there guns shooting wolf ammo.I know first hand about blowing up a gun,but I was shooting military surplus ammo.Its very unerving,I just got lucky and was'nt hurt,but I don't take any chances any more.Only the good stuff for me and my machines.You might shoot wolf ammo all the time,and have no issues,but it only takes once to make a believer out you.I say good luck,and safe shooting.

 

[SigOhio]

I ran a couple boxes of the Wolf Military classic (camo box) through my Sig. From what I read it was loaded hotter then the standard Wolf in the black box. It ran just fine through my Sig, in fact it seemed to cycle slightly faster then the Prvi I normally shoot, so it may have been loaded a bit hotter.

I wasn't interested in dealing with stuck cases or broken/worn extractors, so I haven't tried it again. But it's good to know it could run it if I had to.

 

[seant]

I have put 1000 rounds of wolf military classic through my 556 SBR with out an issue and without cleaning.

My gun has been exceptionally reliable. I cleaned it last week for the first time. Needless to say it was very dirty. I personally wouldn't own a gun that didn't run on cheep ammo at the range.

If a gun is finacky over ammo, I usually trade it for a new gun.

 

[762nato]

I typically just shoot wolf ammo in the winter,because its to hot in the summer,what with all the protective gear I have to wear.First I put on my kevlar vest,then my welding hood,then my welding gloves,kinda hard to get your fingers in the trigger guard.Thank you magpul-enhanced trigger guard ya-know! Then I use someone else's rifle at the range,So no I don't mind shooting wolf ammo in the winter.Also if the gun goes kaput I just throw it away and get another.Because some guns are so finicky they just blow up in your face.But I think I've got that covered you know but mostly in the winter though.Oh make sure to wear your ears,and have a good day! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[seant]

762nato,

Apparently you don't like wolf ammo. Thats fine, if you don't like it, don't buy any. That way there will be more left for me to buy and shoot.

 

[762nato]

Its not that I don't like it,I just don't trust it.My shooting buddy blew the top cover off his pre-ban galil,and locked up his bolt one day.shooting wolf. My buddy that sell's machine guns told me his friend went to the factory in russia were its made.He said he seen a guy scooping gun powder up with a shovel out of a big mound,off the floor loading a hopper.The floor was dirt.so I don't know about quality control over there.I'd say just be careful,and wear your shooting glasses.

 

[Longrifle]

762nato,

Apparently you don't like wolf ammo. Thats fine, if you don't like it, don't buy any. That way there will be more left for me to buy and shoot.

I agree More cheap ammo for you and more M193 for us. Everyone's happy 8)

 

[scooby&thesig]

I have been running wolf military classic (reg black box grey case wolf has more issues), silver bear, brown bear, golden bear in ar's my 556 and ak's for a pretty long time. The bears are are better quality as far as cleaner and less ftf etc. Silver and golden do not take the lacquer bath like the brown does. But some silver and golden have the sealant around the primers which some shooters remove. Bottom line is that I have had a handful of ftf over a long period of time and no explosions, rim ripping off etc. I am not saying that it can't happen, anything can happen with any ammo. A friend had a black hills 68gr hp blue box round blow the crap out of his ar-15 along with his arm and hand, and that is good ammo. He called them up and they basically said "look at the back of the box, no guarantee, it's remanufactured". He also told them upon further inspection of the remaining rounds some had pretty decent dents all over, black hills said politely "read the back of the box, sorry". But, using steel cases in a sig 556 will take more of the finish off where the cases hit after ejecting. I definitely recommend putting a piece of velcro or something where the shell will hits. Bottom line is, everyone has a preference.