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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just picked up my new 556 Classic today and while I have not had an opportunity to tear it down and clean it yet, I did notice that the upper and lower have a little play between them. If I hold the upper and move the lower from side to side or up and down, I can feel and see a little play movement between the two. Is this pretty typical on the 556's? I've only really held one other 556, and it didn't seem as noticeable to me on that one but maybe it was just me because I wasn't really looking or feeling for it. I would like to hear what others have experienced.

- Dtech

Just as an FYI, both of the 556 Classic rifles that I've had my experiences with were manufactured in July 2009 and are JTxxxxxx serial numbers. They were within 60 or 70 production rifles of each other or so.
 

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I just created a thread about the same thing three days ago. I called Sig and mine's going back for a look.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for the heads up PGT. I found your thread and saw all the good info from Ullie and others. Unfortunately, when I hold the foregrip and hold the rifle vertical if I rotate it back and forth or shake it side to side, it "rattles". I can also feel the rifle "adjust" when I bring it up to my shoulder. I also happen to be looking at the bolt and bolt handle over and see what looks like a little tiny line of what looks like rust along the edge where the charging handle meets the bolt underneath. To top it off, I happen to see a small piece of broken plastic inside my case. After checking to see if it was a piece of the magazine, I found that it belonged to the stock extension. One of the six plastic catches that grip the stock is broken as that is where the piece matches up.

What's a bit frustrating is that this is actually the second rifle that was sent to me. I purchased the rifle from Top Gun Supply and while I can say nothing but great things about Tom and Top Gun's customer service and their efforts to make their customers happy, it's a little tough for dealers to do when dealing with a product that has quality issues. The first rifle had issue with the front sight being canted left (along with the gas block it appeard) while the top rail was canted to the right and had some other quality issues. Top Gun sent me the replacment rifle, I never contacted SIG on the first one although that is where Top Gun was sending it back to.

I'll be looking the rifle over even more carfully tomorrow when I have more time and I'll be calling SIG on Monday to let them know about the issues with my rifle and request a shipping label back to them. I'm starting to wonder if the whole $300 rebate thing wasn't just a way for SIG to clear out some "questionable" inventory. Regardless, I'll give SIG the benefit of the doubt and see what happens. Maybe third time's the charm? :roll:

- Dtech
 

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Buy one at a gun shop! So you can "test drive" it before you throw down the cash!

Break it down inspect it, function check and rattle test it.

Geardo
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
After looking the rifle over some more today in better lighting and being able to check all the angles and fit better, it does rattle quite a bit and the top rail still seems like it is tilted over to the right a little although it is more closely aligned front to back with the front sight than the first rifle. The lower and upper seems to have a loose fit at both the front and rear retaining pins as well as the fit within each other.

At this point I don't see this being a Top Gun Supply issue. They've certainly tried to send me a good rifle. I'll be following up with SIG on Monday to have them address the issues directly. At least I already mailed off my $300 rebate so that will be in process.

While I'm certainly disappointed with my experience so far, getting all upset and mad is not going to solve anything. I'll kindly and professionally ask SIG to make things right and give them the opportunity to do so. If things don't get resolved properly during this next attempt though, I think I would be entitled to be a little angry. Here's hoping things get taken care of quickly and once and for all.

-Dtech
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Just as an FYI, both of the 556 Classic rifles that I've had my experiences with were manufactured in July 2009 and are JTxxxxxx serial numbers. They were within 60 or 70 production rifles of each other or so.

Mine also has the newer pivot pin without the screw.
 

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mine was Nov 09 production
 

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The receiver fit isn't amazing on any Sig 556. Mine is from late '07 and has some wobble. This is somewhat expected in this type of rifle.

As for your other issues? Sig seems to have dropped the ball and raised the price on Sig 556's of late. I'd send it back to them and if you're lucky they'll fix it. If you're luckier, they'll just refund your money and you can spend it somewhere else.
 

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Got my 556 today. And I also must say i am very displeased. Mine also has ALOT of play in upper to lower. Its manf date is june 09 i believe. O guess this is what i get for not buying one from a store and seeing it first before dropping the cash for it. For the price of these rifles its crazy the amount of play. :( :( :( :x :x :x
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Well, I was able to speak to SIG today regarding my concerns. They were very friendly and eager to help over the phone! They e-mailed me a shipping label right away and the rifle is already on its way to SIG to be inspected. They said the turn around time should be 2 to 3 weeks including the shipping time. Hopefully they'll just replace it with a thoroughly QC'd new rifle!

- Dtech
 

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2-3 weeks? uggh. How can I DIY a fix? I waited long enough to get the one I have...not interested in sending it back for that log.
 

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They are all a little lose.

If you search this forum their are a bunch of fixes. I have had mine for almost a year now and have shoot it a lot, one of these days I'll fix the rattle.
 

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any advice on the best thread to read up? I'm more than happy to DIY a fix...makes me learn how to work on this particular gun
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I can certainly understand wanting to work on your own gun and familiarizing yourself with it, but a 556 Classic is not my idea of buying a "project gun". ;) However, that doesn't mean that I will not maintain and thoroughly familarize myself with its operation and construction. IMHO, you should be able to buy it, shoot it, and not have to worry about "loose tolerances", "rattles" or DIY "fixes" out of the box, especially for the amount of the investment. Even my Bushmaster M4 style Desert Camo carbine that I bought for practically half the price (before the 556 rebate) a few years ago, doesn't rattle and wiggle like the 556 did. It is also MOA capable and I've shot even smaller three shot groups with the standard iron sights (which are perfectly horizontal and aligned I might add). Again, this is not a knock on SIG as they have been very willing to address my concerns, but IMHO wide allowable tollerances, especially in a high profile product with high consumer expectations will only cause more harm than profit. I'm sure many of us can realize how hard it is to recover once a product or company gets a bad reputation for whatever reason. Just look at certain car manufacturers for good examples.

Maybe there are a lot of people that have lower expectations than I when it comes to firearms these days and don't mind some incosistencies but I for one won't lower my standards, especially once you hit the $1K+ price range. I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting a quality fit,finish, and function gun that represents a good overall value for the features it offers and performs exceptionally well for that kind of money.

8)
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
hattaresguy said:
They are all a little lose.
Actually, they are not "all a little loose", depedning on what your definition of that is. I've seen plenty of people mention tighter tolerances on theirs, and I've experienced it first hand on another Classic I've handled. The empashis should be on consistency rather than a wide "acceptable" tolerance range which yields noticeable differences in your products throughout a production run.
 

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Dtech said:
I can certainly understand wanting to work on your own gun and familiarizing yourself with it, but a 556 Classic is not my idea of buying a "project gun". ;) However, that doesn't mean that I will not maintain and thoroughly familarize myself with its operation and construction. IMHO, you should be able to buy it, shoot it, and not have to worry about "loose tolerances", "rattles" or DIY "fixes" out of the box, especially for the amount of the investment. Even my Bushmaster M4 style Desert Camo carbine that I bought for practically half the price (before the 556 rebate) a few years ago, doesn't rattle and wiggle like the 556 did. It is also MOA capable and I've shot even smaller three shot groups with the standard iron sights (which are perfectly horizontal and aligned I might add). Again, this is not a knock on SIG as they have been very willing to address my concerns, but IMHO wide allowable tollerances, especially in a high profile product with high consumer expectations will only cause more harm than profit. I'm sure many of us can realize how hard it is to recover once a product or company gets a bad reputation for whatever reason. Just look at certain car manufacturers for good examples.

Maybe there are a lot of people that have lower expectations than I when it comes to firearms these days and don't mind some incosistencies but I for one won't lower my standards, especially once you hit the $1K+ price range. I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting a quality fit,finish, and function gun that represents a good overall value for the features it offers and performs exceptionally well for that kind of money.

8)
I couldn't agree more. Let me know how it goes with your dealings with sig i might also have to give them a call.
 

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Strangely enough, I have yet to see anyone spell out what play is within design tolerances. I just measured mine, which is essentially brand new (shot once so far): .009 gap,right above the rear pin.

So, what is acceptable?
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Since SIG is not likely to release tolerance info for a lot of reasons, it is pretty much a subjective determination unless something else goes wrong with a rifle and it can be attributed to the fitment/tolerances of parts. On the other hand, it could be something as obvious as poor accuracy due to barrel/receiver harmonics and shot to shot inconsistency.
 

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I just went and broke mine out to check out how bad it really is. I think a pair of very thin stainless or delrin washers are all that's needed to 'fix' the play. it feels bad because it's an equal amount of play front and rear. Something like a thin wave spring or wave washer
 

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My 556 ER has the same play you are talking about. It will shoot sub moa groups and functions fine. The main rattle it had was the trigger guard. I fabricated a thin rubber washer that went over the spring loaded pin. No more rattle. I also stopped the up-down movement at the rear pin by adding a round rubber spacer inserted into the recess for the hand grip screw. No more movement.
 
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